Although from his website Mr. Rehov is clearly appalled by this pathological attitude and behavior, he unfortunately repeated the disturbing and perilous platitude that it's not Islam but extremists who are the problem. Granted, extremists are a problem, but "innocent" Islam is not. Rehov went so far as to say that "Islam is a beautiful religion." In consideration of its history and all that we know about Islam, including widespread violence, torture and murder wherever it is found, we would really like to know exactly what is "beautiful" about Islam?
- Is the suppression and oppression - the torture - of women "beautiful?"
"Men have authority over women because God has made the one superior to the other, and because they spend their wealth to maintain them. Good women are obedient." (Q 4:34)The Prophet Mohammed is quoted as saying:
"I was standing at the edge of the fire (hell) and the majority of the people going in were women."This gruesome image shows an Iranian woman beaten for not covering her hair properly - but one example of sharia or Islamic law. (Reproduced with permission from the Dr. Homa Darabi Foundation.)
The vicious attitude towards and vile treatment of women within Islam is spreading throughout the world:
"From 1998 until 2002, Muslim male gangs taunted Australian girls, particularly in Sydney. The females were labeled 'sluts' and 'Aussie pigs,' therefore, they were bait for rape.There simply is no excuse for this evil mentality and behavior, but there will be many who deny that it exists, adding insult to the severe injuries - including hideous rape and murder - suffered by its victims.
"In Australia's New South Wales Supreme Court in December 2005, a visiting Pakistani rapist testified that his victims had no right to say no, because they were not wearing a headscarf...
"As more and more Muslims move into Western nations, this gang rape will increase because it is part of the Muslim male killing cult, otherwise known as their 'religion.'"
- Is the constant call for the deaths of infidels something "beautiful?"
"This Book is not to be doubted.... As for the unbelievers, it is the same whether or not you forewarn them; they will not have faith. God has set a seal upon their hearts and ears; their sight is dimmed and grievous punishment awaits them." (Q 2:2-6)
"God's curse be upon the infidels! Evil is that for which they have bartered away their souls. To deny God's own revelation, grudging that He should reveal His bounty to whom He chooses from among His servants! They have incurred God's most inexorable wrath. An ignominious punishment awaits the unbelievers." (Q 2:92-6)
"... Slay them wherever you find them. Drive them out of the places from which they drove you. Idolatry is worse than carnage." (Q 2:190-3)
"When the sacred months are over slay the idolaters wherever you find them. Arrest them, besiege them, and lie in ambush everywhere for them." (Q 9:5)
"Prophet, make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites and deal rigorously with them. Hell shall be their home: an evil fate." (Q 9:73)These are direct quotes from the Koran, translated but not "interpreted." No interpretation is necessary, as the meaning is clear.
- Is the repression of sex to the point of driving young men to want to kill themselves and others somehow "beautiful?"
Note that these last scriptures promise appealing young boys to serve the men who arrive in Paradise."The righteous shall return to a blessed retreat: the gardens of Eden, whose gates shall open wide to receive them. Reclining there with bashful virgins for companions, they will call for abundant fruit and drink." (Q 38:51-2)
"On that day [the unbelievers] shall be sternly thrown into the fire of Hell... But in fair gardens the righteous shall dwell in bliss, rejoicing in what their Lord will give them. Their Lord will shield them from the scourge of Hell. He will say: Eat and drink to your hearts content. This is the reward of your labours.
"They shall recline on couches ranged in rows. To dark-eyed houris [virgin girls] We shall wed them.... Fruit We shall give them, and such meats as they desire. They will pass from hand to hand a cup inspiring no idle talk, no sinful urge; and there shall wait on them young boys of their own, as fair as virgin pearls." (Q 52:13-24)
"Reclining there upon soft couches, they shall feel neither the scorching heat nor the biting cold. Trees will spread their shade around them, and fruits will hang in clusters over them.
"They shall be served with silver dishes, and beakers as large as goblets; silver goblets which they themselves shall measure: and cups brim-full with ginger-flavoured water from a fount called Salsabil. They shall be attended by boys graced with eternal youth, who to the beholders eyes will seem like sprinkled pearls. When you gave upon that scene, you will behold a kingdom blissful and glorious." (Q 76:9-20)
None of the despicable and inhuman behavior brought out by these scriptures is "extremist" within Islam - it is mainstream. In the future, it would be best to question what exactly is "beautiful" about Islam?
I'm waiting to hear.
(More illustrations of "beautiful Islam." Warning: Extremely gruesome.)
48 comments:
Acharya,
You are falling for a stereotype. That is not like you. Read Karen Armstrong books Mohammed, and Short History of Islam. For two hundred years,Moorish Spain, Moslems,Jews, and Christians got along and created a remarkable civilization, way ahead of medieval Europe. It helped create Renaissance.
Karen Armstrong is an Islamic apologist. Maybe she got money from the Moslems. So if Islam "helped create the Renaissance", it's entitled to the atrocities it (and other religions) continue to create?
Thank you.
It is not "like me" because I am certainly not "falling for a stereotype." I have been studying Islam for many years and have written extensively about the same - anyone who actually knows me knows that fact. One needn't study for decades, however, but need only look around and take account of the countless examples of the human- and woman-abusing nature of Islam.
On the contrary to your suggestion, it appears to be you who are exemplifying the "denial" aspect of my statement.
For further edification, please read Quotes from Islam and many other writings and posts on my websites and elsewhere, as at Truth About Islam. In that last forum thread, you will find an essay entitled "The Myths of Islam" which addresses the issues you raise.
If you really knew me, you would grok that I am not one to stand around and let this woman-hating ideology and its vicious sharia law spread unchecked to our own shores. I am not going to blithely accept my subjugation nor that of my loved ones.
Acharya, my point of view as far as Islam goes is that they are passing thruoght their dark ages. The psychological profile of an islamic extremist does match perfectly the christian medieval mentality of the burning times.
It is sad to see these attitudes persisting in the World. What can you expect form uneducated people that only learn to read and write for religious purposes.
I believe that this war no matter how you put it will end in a genocide. It is a matter of them or us. As for me goes let it be them. We do not need religious nor political control.
I remember Pink Floyd's song that says "We don't need no thought control...Hey teacher leave the kids alone!........
The fact there are so many individuals claiming to eschew the violence and degradation found in the Koran - yet fervently maintaining their allegiance to Islam - "merely" illustrates the insidious nature of this schizophrenia-producing brainwashing.
It is the nature of religion in general to destroy rationality - and integrity, as is manifested abundantly in the blind, stubborn and dishonest belief in assorted absurdities and deleterious notions.
says "Is the suppression and oppression - the torture - of women "beautiful?"
Is the constant call for the deaths of infidels something "beautiful?"
Is the repression of sex to the point of driving young men to want to kill themselves and others somehow "beautiful?"
None of this despicable and inhuman behavior is "extremist" within Islam - it is mainstream"
HOW HARMFULLY IGNORANT! INDONESIA AND INDIA HAVE THE WORLD'S LARGEST ISLAMIC POPULATION AND NONE OF THE ABOVE APPLIES. JUST AS IT DID NOT APPLY TO HUSSEIN'S IRAQ.
ALL MAJOR RELIGIONS JUDAISM CHRISTIANITY ISLAM HINDUISM ARE FIGHTING A BATTLE BETWEEN THE MAJORITY MODERATES AND EXTREME FUNDAMENTALISTS.
PS ABSOLUTELY NO UNDERSTANDING OF THE TYPICAL SUICIDE BOMBER PROFILE. BY THE BY THE INSPIRATION FOR ISLAMIC SUICIDE BOMBINGS ARE SRI LANKAN TAMIL HINDUS!!!!
Dear Acharia:
I personally believe that Islam still in the dark ages. Their respective mentality is one of "Allah (God) wills it! They do not understand, as any fanatic, that every human being has the godgiven right to live as it pleases.
Sadly enough this stupid war will end up in a genocide. Either they kill us or we kill them! My thinking is better them than us! So whatever people do we are in wave of violence for the long haul.
Who is a moslem? Who is a christian? That is of the people's chosing, I dicided to be a human being without any restrictions whatsoever. As most part of mankind I want to live in peace and that means a continuous practice of tolerance. Islam is a non tolerating religion therefore we have to abide by the words of MArcus Aurelius, "Si Vis Pacemen, Parabellum".
If you ever come to Puerto Rico, let me know I want meet you personally and enjoy a good conversation with a good cup of puertorican coffee!
By the way, it matters not what nation can be held up as a "model" of "Islamic moderation," the fact will remain that the abuse of women and non-Muslims is mandated in the Koran itself and are thus mainstream Muslim tenets.
A true "moderate" would repudiate these anti-human statements in the Koran itself, which would open him or her up to the very wrath being discussed here. And, by definition, such repudiation would make the moderate a non-Muslim. Hence, there can be no "moderate Muslims."
Acharya,
I have followed your postings for the last couple months. I have found little or no usefulness in them although as someone far from the mainstream of any religion I had hoped to find a common ground.
Here, I strongly believe you have crossed the line. While I will not argue the relative merits of Islam, if you look at the points made about Islam's alleged wrongs, you will see very clearly that there is nothing mentioned there which is not also advocated in the christian bible. Extremists of any religion are dangerous. It doesn't much matter what denomination they are.
Having said that, what bothers me most about this post is that you are egging on--rather than attempting to shed light--upon the differences (and shortcomings) between Islam and other religions. And it is precisely this that now has us embroiled in a losing war which was entered into exactly because of this kind of prejudice. Whether or not the allegations are true--and I believe they are for many fundamental religions--it is MOST unwise to be banging this particular gong at this particular time. You've evidenced very poor judgement.
I am a promotions consultant by trade and I'm very vocal about promoting those groups and individuals who have a valuable message to share. In this case and sadly, I believe I need to spread the word about your stance and your work as being a very unhelpful and unstable source of information.
I hope you'll reconsider flaming this particular fire.
Ranee Decker
Nice ad hominem attack... you've just attacked Acharya & yet you couldn't provide ANYTHING beautiful or peaceful about Islam. If Islam is so beautiful & peaceful then it should be a breeze to prove it.
This is a typical response anytime I see someone expose the facts about religion regardless of what religion it is. I always see Muslims pointing out what Christianity has done as if that makes it all better - it doesn't. Religion is a poison. Islam is no better.
Don't be ridiculous. So, if there's nothing "useful" about Acharya's posts, why would you be reading them over the past couple of months?
I find nothing useful in your post, other than you are threatening to give Acharya's views more publicity.
Like Anon said, no evidence of Islam's "beauty," just a personal attack. No concern with the people being abused by religion, just whether or not Acharya should speak out against it?
Ridiculous.
This is Pierre Rehov
I fell on this blog by accident. I guess you really do not get it ! I have no sympathy for those guys at all. Please, check my website : www.pierrerehov.com, and you will understand what I am all about.
Thanks
G'day Pierre,
Good to have you here. I saw you on the Daily Show too & honestly, you made a few comments that seemed a bit contradictory to having "no sympathy for those guys". You mentioned how the "French are sympathetic to them" & are "100% on their side". Either you miss spoke or I didn't hear you right.
I stand corrected then, apologize for having besmirched you, and have changed my post accordingly. I did not mean to suggest that you sympathized with what the bombers were doing.
I heard you say that the suicide bombers trusted your team because they believe the French are "100% on their side," and I misstated your position. It is a shame that the French have given the impression that they are "100% on their side."
I DO want to know what you find "beautiful" about Islam? I will head to your site to see if your views are there.
I think the reason why so few dare to criticize Islam or any religion is because the civilized behavior we are taught from birth. We are taught not to speak our mind, and also to believe the hypocrisy we are surrounded with because of that.
It's quite simple, really. Islam and Christianity and bunch should all be criticized on equal terms. The similarities between them are bigger than the differences. There are variations within the theme, but none that matters, in my opinion.
They are all bad beyond bad, and this fact should be cried from the rooftops at any opportunity.
To treat Islam as a polar opposite is the basis of our cultural divide. Read here the strategic motives behind the establishment of an Arab based Abraham religion.
Then understand how the puppet masters play the ends off against the middle.
'How the Vatican created Islam'
Source: http://www.cloakanddagger.de/lenny/alberto_rivera.htm
How the Vatican created Islam. The astonishing story from an ex-Jesuit priest, Alberto Rivera, which was told to him by Cardinal Bea while he was at the Vatican.
From "The Prophet":
http://www.choosinglife.net/Islam.htm
This information came from Alberto Rivera, former Jesuit priest after his conversion to Protestant Christianity. It is excerpted from "The Prophet," published by Chick Publications, PO Box 662, Chino CA 91708. Since its publication, after several unsuccessful attempts on his life, he died suddenly from food poisoning. His testimony should not be silenced. Dr. Rivera speaks to us still ...
"What I'm going to tell you is what I learned in secret briefings in the Vatican when I was a Jesuit priest, under oath and induction. A Jesuit cardinal named Augustine Bea showed us how desperately the Roman Catholics wanted Jerusalem at the end of the third century. Because of its religious history and its strategic location, the Holy City was considered a priceless treasure. A scheme had to be developed to make Jerusalem a Roman Catholic city.
"The great untapped source of manpower that could do this job was the children of Ishmael. The poor Arabs fell victim to one of the most clever plans ever devised by the powers of darkness. Early Christians went everywhere with the gospel setting up small churches, but they met heavy opposition. Both the Jews and the Roman government persecuted the believers in Christ to stop their spread. But the Jews rebelled against Rome, and in 70 AD, Roman armies under General Titus smashed Jerusalem and destroyed the great Jewish temple which was the heart of Jewish worship...in fulfillment of Christ's prophecy in Matthew 24:2.
"On this holy placed today where the temple once stood, the Dome of the Rock Mosque stands as Islam's second most holy place. Sweeping changes were in the wind. Corruption, apathy, greed, cruelty, perversion and rebellion were eating at the Roman Empire, and it was ready to collapse. The persecution against Christians was useless as they continued to lay down their lives for the gospel of Christ.
"The only way Satan could stop this thrust was to create a counterfeit "Christian" religion to destroy the work of God. The solution was in Rome. Their religion had come from ancient Babylon and all it needed was a face-lift. This didn't happen overnight, but began in the writings of the 'early church fathers'.
"It was through their writings that a new religion would take shape. The statue of Jupiter in Rome was eventually called St. Peter, and the statue of Venus was changed to the Virgin Mary. The site chosen for its headquarters was on one of the seven hills called 'Vaticanus', the place of the diving serpent where the Satanic temple of Janus stood.
"The great counterfeit religion was Roman Catholicism, called 'Mystery, Babylon the Great, the Mother of Harlots and Abominations of the Earth'- Revelation 17:5. She was raised up to block the gospel, slaughter the believers in Christ, establish religions, create wars and make the nations drunk with the wine of her fornication as we will see.
"Three major religions have one thing in common - each has a holy place where they look for guidance. Roman Catholicism looks to the Vatican as the Holy City. The Jews look to the wailing wall in Jerusalem, and the Muslims look to Mecca as their Holy City. Each group believes that they receive certain types of blessings for the rest of their lives for visiting their holy place. In the beginning, Arab visitors would bring gifts to the 'House of God', and the keepers of the Kaaba were gracious to all who came. Some brought their idols and, not wanting to offend these people, their idols were placed inside the sanctuary. It is said that the Jews looked upon the Kaaba as an outlying tabernacle of the Lord with veneration until it became polluted with idols.
"In a tribal contention over a well(Zamzam) the treasure of the Kaaba and the offerings that pilgrims had given were dumped down the well and it was filled with sand - it disappeared. Many years later Adb Al-Muttalib was given visions telling him where to find the well and its treasure. He became the hero of Mecca, and he was destined to become the grandfather of Muhammad. Before this time, Augustine became the bishop of North Africa and was effective in winning Arabs to Roman Catholicism, including whole tribes. It was among these Arab converts to Catholicism that the concept of looking for an Arab prophet developed.
"Muhammad's father died from illness and sons born to great Arab families in places like Mecca were sent into the desert to be suckled and weaned and spend some of their childhood with Bedouin tribes for training and to avoid the plagues in the cities.
"After his mother and grandfather also died, Muhammad was with his uncle when a Roman Catholic monk learned of his identity and said, "Take your brother's son back to his country and guard him against the Jews, for by god, if they see him and know of him that which I know, they will construe evil against him. Great things are in store for this brother's son of yours."
"The Roman Catholic monk had fanned the flames for future Jewish persecutions at the hands of the followers of Muhammad. The Vatican desperately wanted Jerusalem because of its religious significance, but was blocked by the Jews.
"Another problem was the true Christians in North Africa who preached the gospel. Roman Catholicism was growing in power, but would not tolerate opposition. Somehow the Vatican had to create a weapon to eliminate both the Jews and the true Christian believers who refused to accept Roman Catholicism. Lookng to North Africa, they saw the multitudes of Arabs as a source of manpower to do their dirty work. Some Arabs had become Roman Catholic, and could be used in reporting information to leaders in Rome. Others were used in an underground spy network to carry out Rome's master plan to control the great multitudes of Arabs who rejected Catholicism. When 'St Augustine' appeared on the scene, he knew what was going on. His monasteries served as bases to seek out and destroy Bible manuscripts owned by the true Christians.
"The Vatican wanted to create a messiah for the Arabs, someone they could raise up as a great leader, a man with charisma whom they could train, and eventually unite all the non-Catholic Arabs behind him, creating a mighty army that would ultimately capture Jerusalem for the pope. In the Vatican briefing, Cardinal Bea told us this story:
'A wealthy Arabian lady who was a faithful follower of the pope played a tremendous part in this drama. She was a widow named Khadijah. She gave her wealth to the church and retired to a convent, but was given an assignment. She was to find a brilliant young man who could be used by the Vatican to create a new religion and become the messiah for the children of Ishmael. Khadijah had a cousin named Waraquah,, who was also a very faithful Roman Catholic and the Vatican placed him in a critical role as Muhammad's advisor. He had tremendous influence on Muhammad.
'Teachers were sent to young Muhammad and he had intensive training. Muhammad studied the works of St. Augustine which prepared him for his "great calling." The Vatican had Catholic Arabs across North Africa spread the story of a great one who was about to rise up among the people and be the chosen one of their God.
'While Muhammad was being prepared, he was told that his enemies were the Jews and that the only true Christians were Roman Catholic. He was taught that others calling themselves Christians were actually wicked impostors and should be destroyed. Many Muslims believe this.
'Muhammad began receiving "divine revelations" and his wife's Catholic cousin Waraquah helped interpret them. From this came the Koran. In the fifth year of Muhammad's mission, persecution came against his followers because they refused to worship the idols in the Kaaba.
'Muhammad instructed some of them to flee to Abysinnia where Negus, the Roman Catholic king accepted them because Muhammad's views on the virgin Mary were so close to Roman Catholic doctrine. These Muslims received protection from Catholic kings because of Muhammad's revelations.
'Muhammad later conquered Mecca and the Kaaba was cleared of idols. History proves that before Islam came into existence, the Sabeans in Arabia worshiped the moon-god who was married to the sun-god. They gave birth to three goddesses who were worshipped throughout the Arab world as "Daughters of Allah" An idol excavated at Hazor in Palestine in 1950's shows Allah sitting on a throne with the crescent moon on his chest.
'Muhammad claimed he had a vision from Allah and was told, "You are the messenger of Allah." This began his career as a prophet and he received many messages. By the time Muhammad died, the religion of Islam was exploding. The nomadic Arab tribes were joining forces in the name of Allah and his prophet, Muhammad.
'Some of Muhammad's writings were placed in the Koran, others were never published. They are now in the hands of high ranking holy men (Ayatollahs) in the Islamic faith.'
"When Cardinal Bea shared with us in the Vatican, he said, these writings are guarded because they contain information that links the Vatican to the creation of Islam. Both sides have so much information on each other, that if exposed, it could create such a scandal that it would be a disaster for both religions.
"In their "holy" book, the Koran, Christ is regarded as only a prophet. If the pope was His representative on earth, then he also must be a prophet of God. This caused the followers of Muhammad to fear and respect the pope as another "holy man."
"The pope moved quickly and issued bulls granting the Arab generals permission to invade and conquer the nations of North Africa. The Vatican helped to finance the building of these massive Islamic armies in exchange for three favors:
1. Eliminate the Jews and Christians (true believers, which they called infidels).
2. Protect the Augustinian Monks and Roman Catholics.
3. Conquer Jerusalem for "His Holiness" in the Vatican.
"As time went by, the power of Islam became tremendous - Jews and true Christians were slaughtered, and Jerusalem fell into their hands. Roman Catholics were never attacked, nor were their shrines, during this time. But when the pope asked for Jerusalem, he was surprised at their denial! The Arab generals had such military success that they could not be intimidated by the pope - nothing could stand in the way of their own plan.
"Under Waraquah's direction, Muhammad wrote that Abraham offered Ishmael as a sacrifice. The Bible says that Isaac was the sacrifice, but Muhammad removed Isaac's name and inserted Ishmael's name. As a result of this and Muhammad's vision, the faithful Muslims built a mosque, the Dome of the Rock, in Ishmael's honor on the site of the Jewish temple that was destroyed in 70 AD. This made Jerusalem the 2nd most holy place in the Islam faith. How could they give such a sacred shrine to the pope without causing a revolt?
"The pope realized what they had created was out of control when he heard they were calling "His Holiness" an infidel. The Muslim generals were determined to conquer the world for Allah and now they turned toward Europe. Islamic ambassadors approached the pope and asked for papal bulls to give them permission to invade European countries.
"The Vatican was outraged; war was inevitable. Temporal power and control of the world was considered the basic right of the pope. He wouldn't think of sharing it with those whom he considered heathens.
"The pope raised up his armies and called them crusades to hold back the children of Ishmael from grabbing Catholic Europe. The crusades lasted centuries and Jerusalem slipped out of the pope's hands.
"Turkey fell and Spain and Portugal were invaded by Islamic forces. In Portugal, they called a mountain village "Fatima" in honor of Muhammad's daughter, never dreaming it would become world famous.
"Years later when the Muslim armies were poised on the islands of Sardinia and Corsica, to invade Italy, there was a serious problem. The Islamic generals realized they were too far extended. It was time for peace talks. One of the negotiators was Francis of Assisi.
"As a result, the Muslims were allowed to occupy Turkey in a "Christian" world, and the Catholics were allowed to occupy Lebanon in the Arab world. It was also agreed that the Muslims could build mosques in Catholic countries without interference as long as Roman Catholicism could flourish Arab countries.
"Cardinal Bea told us in Vatican briefings that both the Muslims and Roman Catholics agreed to block and destroy the efforts of their common enemy, Bible-believing Christianm missionaries. Through these concordats, Satan blocked the children of Ishmael from a knowledge of Scripture and the truth.
"A light control was kept on Muslims from the Ayatollah down through the Islamic priests, nuns and monks. The Vatican also engineers a campaign of hatred between the Muslim Arabs and the Jews. Before this, they had co-existed peacefully.
"The Islamic community looks on the Bible-believing missionary as a devil who brings poison to the children of Allah. This explains years of ministry in those countries with little results.
"The next plan was to control Islam. In 1910, Portugal was going Socialistic. Red flags were appearing and the Catholic Church was facing a major problem. Increasing numbers were against the church.
"The Jesuits wanted Russia involved, and the location of this vision at Fatima could play a key part in pulling Islam to the Mother Church.
"In 1917, the Virgin appeared in Fatima. "The Mother of God" was a smashing success, playing to overflow crowds. As a result, the Socialists of Portugal suffered a major defeat.
"Roman Catholics world-wide began praying for the conversion of Russia and the Jesuits invented the Novenas to Fatima which they could perform throughout North Africa, spreading good public relations to the Muslim world. The Arabs thought they were honoring the daughter of Muhammad, which is what the Jesuits wanted them to believe.
"As a result of the vision of Fatima, Pope Pius XII ordered his Nazi army to crush Russia and the Orthodox religion and make Russia Roman Catholic." A few years after he lost World war II, Pope Pius XII startled the world with his phoney dancing sun vision to keep Fatima in the news. It was great religious show biz and the world swallowed it.
"Not surprisingly, Pope Pius was the only one to see this vision. As a result, a group of followers has grown into a Blue Army world-wide, totaling millions of faithful Roman Catholics ready to die for the blessed virgin.
"But we haven't seen anything yet. The Jesuits have their Virgin Mary scheduled to appear four or five times in China, Russia, and major appearance in the U.S.
"What has this got to do with Islam? Note Bishop Sheen's
statement: "Our Lady's appearances at Fatima marked the turning point in the history of the world's 350 million Muslims. After the death of his daughter, Muhammad wrote that she "is the most holy of all women in Paradise, next to Mary."
"He believed that the Virgin Mary chose to be known as Our Lady of Fatima as a sign and a pledge that the Muslims who believe in Christ's virgin birth, will come to believe in His divinity.
"Bishop Sheen pointed out that the pilgrim virgin statues of Our Lady of Fatima were enthusiastically received by Muslims in Africa, India, and elsewhere, and that many Muslims are now coming into the Roman Catholic Church."
Thanks. I'm aware of the conspiracy theories regarding the origins of Islam. Such theories make the ideology no less condemnable. Au contraire - the people caught in the net of Islam and spreading its irrationality worldwide must also become aware of its nature so that they can overcome it and just be human beings, without the divisive labels.
It is the Perversion of the Koran that is abominable.
I really enjoy your books Acharya, but this is just ridiculous.
To single out Islam comes off very badly, when all the religions of the Abrahamic tradition espouse violence against "unbelievers". To only talk about one of them in this context is borderline intellectually dishonest and comes off as very xenophobic. Or as one earlier commenter said, it only helps to divide us more.
I see, so you've enjoyed my books, where I single out Christianity and Judaism for criticism, but Islam is off limits?
Then, after making this blatantly hypocritical remark, you engage in an ad hominem attack on me. Talk about intellectual dishonesty! Not mention verbal violence upon my person.
Anyone who actually HAS read my works knows that I spend much time and spill much ink criticizing ALL religions, whether "Abrahamic" or not.
This coddling of Islam is what is really ridiculous - and quite dangerous.
You have no concern about the poor people who are suffering daily from Islam's terrible yoke, but wish to castigate ME for bringing it up.
Rather appalling, I'd say.
What is really divisive is the denial that prevents people from inspecting clearly the follies that will surely destroy them, including and especially heinous religious ideologies that claim to originate with an omnipotent tyrant in the sky.
Unity will appear only when all people of conscience condemn all condemnable ideologies and practices.
Acharya,
You wrote:
The Koran/Quran itself contains repeated statements to torment and kill unbelievers:
You also wrote:
"... Slay them wherever you find them. Drive them out of the places from which they drove you. Idolatry is worse than carnage." (Q 2:190-3)
and:
"When the sacred months are over slay the idolaters wherever you find them. Arrest them, besiege them, and lie in ambush everywhere for them." (Q 9:5)
I respond:
First of all, when you quoted Quran 2:190-3, you only quoted half the passage and didn't bother to give the where and when of this particular chapter.
Here is the FULL passage:
2:190 And fight in the way of Allah with those who fight with you, and do not exceed the limits, surely Allah does not love those who exceed the limits.
2:191 And kill them wherever you find them, and drive them out from whence they drove you out, and persecution is severer than slaughter, and do not fight with them at the Sacred Mosque until they fight with you in it, but if they do fight you, then slay them; such is the recompense of the unbelievers.
2:192 But if they desist, then surely Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.
2:193 And fight with them until there is no persecution, and religion should be only for Allah, but if they desist, then there should be no hostility except against the oppressors.
The occasion of this Surah was the founding of the Islamic State in Medina. Muhammad had been rejected by the polytheists in Mecca who had been persecuting the Muslims. Some Muslims had to go to Ethiopia and find refuge of the Christian king there. Those Muslims being persecuted in Mecca made the Hegira to Medina where Muhammad had been selected to govern the city. The Meccans had declared war upon the Muslims. This second Surah of the Quran described basic government for the Islamic state. Several topics are discussed. One of them was the rules of warfare when defending against the Meccan army.
Also, if you read all of the 9th Surah in its historical context, again "the limits" of defensive warfare are given.
Lastly, I must say that when I saw you that you quoted half the passage, I all I think was "Here we go again!". If you have studied Islam, as you say, why did you decide not to give the full passage?
Also, the word "infidel" in the translation you used should actually be translated "disbeliever". These passage deal with attacks against the Islamic state. By the way, although we can find modern fundamentalist Muslims who call Jews and Christians "disbelievers", traditionally, Jews and Christians were "People of the Book".
I have much more to say, but I'm very discouraged because of the way you treated one of the most important passages in the Quran on warfare. You seem to be saying that mainstream Muslims (do you mean traditional Sunnis and Shias?) that are plainly not true. I'm conservative. My wife wears hijab. I may be an American convert, but most of the Muslims I (Shias) are Arabs, Iranians, Pakistani, or from the subcontinent. None of them act the way you seemed to describe in your blog.
Now, perhaps you have gaps in your knowledge about Islam and different kinds of Muslims. That can easily be remedied. Since quoting the entire section in Quran Surah 2 changes the the meaning drastically, are you willing to admit that the Quran does not teach "go kill everyone not like you", or will you hold your position despite the meaning of the complete section in the context of the defense of Medina against the Meccan army?
I left out that part of the scripture for two reasons: 1. It would require an exegesis too long for this blog; and 2. I am well aware of the "context" argument and find it to be invalid.
The fact is that Islam's most fervent representatives take that scripture out of context ALL the time as they use it to justify murdering unbelievers, infidels, nonbelievers and/or "people of the book," regardless of any nitpicking about what to call them. I understand that your perspective of this issue allows you to have a clear conscience concerning your conversion, but the fact will remain that this excuse is merely a palliative for something that is simply not right.
It is beyond me why any sensible individual would willingly convert to such a heinous and repressive ideology, so I confess that you lose me utterly when you admit to being a convert. To me it's like saying you volunteered to go to a violent prison.
I am not interested in the minutiae of Muslim history, as I find it to be as replete with horror as the biblical tradition.
Holding up individuals who do not behave badly does not constitute scientific invalidation of the atrociousness of an ideology. The FACT is that Islam calls for the abuse of women and the deaths of infidels, regardless of how much sophistry or objections one comes up with. And this fact has been borne out abundantly over the centuries - no amount of denial will make the record go away.
The sad fact is that individuals such as naive American converts will be the first to suffer from sharia law - the first of those who survive the planned Muslim domination, of course.
Whenever I see a Muslim woman wearing a hijab, I feel like pulling it off and telling her she's in a free country now. Your wife's headdress is a serious symbol of women abuse and oppression.
I will burn in hell for saying this but...God is the true example of a idiot. For creating such a people as that, you cannot be sane..send me to the pits, it's your game anyway but I cannot believe mistake after mistake was made in creation of this goofed up world and I'm to believe your perfect. NOT!
Yes, Philip, you seem very sweet - and extremely naive. If anyone's fallen into a "trap," it's not me.
In the first paragraph you demonstrate the absolute brutality and barbarism of this ideology, and then you attempt to defend it to me. I cannot be persuaded of something that is simply not being presented as it really is. It would very much behoove people to investigate the experiences of people who have actually lived under Muslim rule - and those who have instigated said rule are quite certain that it IS Muslim rule. You would be considered a diabolic blasphemer worthy of execution for claiming that it is NOT Muslim rule.
These individuals to a one describe a hideous and barbaric form of tyranny that cares not a fig for the human being but spits all over it.
The only thing I'm hindering with my blog is the spread of this venomous mentality.
No, it doesn't matter what you dredge up from the Koran, if you are going to wave your hands and try to distract from those copious scriptures that are frankly evil. These need to be condemned, not subjected to frantic pointing in another direction.
And I fear that lending your support - nay, your very soul - to the "moderates" will only prevent the disintegration of this hideous ideology. You are blocking the light from reaching the festering wound.
"God has set a seal upon their hearts and ears; their sight is dimmed and grievous punishment awaits them." (Q 2:2-6)"
What kind of God blindfolds his own creations so they don't see the error of their ways or the behavior I would think he would prefer them to follow? This makes no sense!!! Is it any wonder people who follow these religions(Islam & Christianity) sometimes exhibit schizophrenic type behavior?
There is extremely very little (next to nothing) "beautiful" about "The Book". Anything based upon it is sewage-stained toilet-tissue. What book am I referring to? Any religious tome which declares itself to come from god through the agency of some human being. Flush it back down the toilet quickly wether it calls itself Torah, Gospels, Koran, the Book of Mormon...ad infinitum! They are all the same conflicatory crap.
The Jew is the same as the Muslim is the same as the Christian, is the same as the Mormon and so on. I will not argue details of nonsense with blind fools who will not think for themselves. I am only concerned with the fruits of those worshipping that which the toilet has asked them to regard as sacred and holy. I could care less wether you consider yourself a moderate, a fundy or whateva...you smell of the stink that attaches itself to you in the form of "The Book"(s).
What are the fruits, the actions thereby? Mental instability, denial, irrational atttachment, obsession with war, conflict, abuse (of women, men, children--all), dominance, cruelty and the list goes on. Who would want to be associated with any of this sewage in name or deed?!
Flush it back down the toilet of your mind if you really want to be rid of what is WRONG with you and the world at large. As for those intransigent fundy leader-directors of the toilet-paper brigade...you shall receive your reward in the bottomless pit of stench from which your masters came.
When will people realize that the religious moderates are the mechanisms that keep the machine running for the extremists? Muslim, Christian or otherwise. (Is there a non-anti-Semitic way to label the Jewish faith?) As long as people read a book plagued with death, prejudice and hate and can see a rosy side, (let alone see it overall as beautiful) we will have problems. And the more slack we give the "normal" followers of a religion, the more power the nutjobs get. Sigh.
Acharya,
May I ask which translation of the Koran you are using?
From The Holy Qur'an, Arabic Text, English Translation and Commentary by Maulana
Muhammad Ali, l963
Sura Q 38:51-2 you quote"The righteous shall return to a blessed retreat: the gardens of Eden, whose gates shall open wide to receive them. Reclining there with bashful virgins for companions, they call for abundant fruit and drink." This Sura of the Qur'an does not contain the words "with bashful virgins for companions". This is a complete misrepentation of this Sura. The others you quote are takn out of context..as Mohammad insisted they only fight in defense against those who attacked them.
Which translation of the Qur'an do you use? It doesn't follow the Arabic.
Best,
Geneva
The link I provided to the quotes from Islam has the citation at the top: Dawood's translation.
Are you reading the Arabic or relying on a translation? Do you really know Arabic that well?
Which part, exactly, is "lies?" The quotes from the Koran about abusing women?
The image was provided by the Dr. Haoma Darabi Foundation - I highly doubt that it is "bullshit," and your shameful remarks are very insulting to the poor woman who endured this heinous abuse.
Even without this particular image, the rest stands and the horrendous anti-human ideology reflected within Islam can be demonstrated endlessly with other examples. It is clear it is not we who are "ignorant" but Muslim apologists.
acharya, I don't know how you stomach the PC/multicultural/religious apologists! The same people who would laud your work on the Jesus myth, because of anti Christian feelings and tolerance of Islam is in vogue, get defensive when these barbarians are exposed. IT'S ALL A MIND CONTROL MAFIA! Your critics may as well say, "yes, Acharya, the Gabinos are devils, but the Maranzanos are, at their core, a beautiful family", LOL!!! It's ALL fucking organized crime under the banner of Abraham. Kuddos to you for calling out evil wherever it is.
The introduction of Islam, to the west is to create division and political/cultural Balkanization. Destroy the cohesion of any people (be it in Iraq or Sweden) and they become easily controlled. The name of the game is divide and conquer by forcing people together under the sham of "tolerance". Would we be tolerant of an infiltration of Ku Klux Klan into the black neighborhoods of Detriot? Hell no. Would we say the Klan should be understood - afterall that lynching thing is in the past? No different with religion.
The truth lies in the Qu'ran. It speaks for itself. It's a vile and repugnant philosophy and all self claimed "moderates" must account for the system they adopt. A Neo Nazi is still a Nazi.
It is SOOOOOOOO obvious your critics are not Americans. The mind control grip is much tighter on Europe and the UK - making excuces for Islam even in the face soaring rape stats in Sweden, or the murder of Van Gogh. It seems only the Danes are fed up.
New World Order mind control is banking on Islam to reduce us to the dark ages, while corporations rule the world. Fuck that.
Keep up the good work. You have a friend in Michigan.
susan o.
I agree with much of what you've said, Friend in Michigan.
We are surely being set up for destruction. A horrible crime, indeed, as we have spent so many years fighting for the right to be free of heinous and evil religious ideologies that enslave the body, mind and soul.
Now, we are being confronted with the MOST barbaric of the bunch - and the namby-pambies fuss and whine about our resistance towards our pending DHIMMITUDE.
From The Religion of Peace website:
dhim·mi (dm or zm) - A Qur'anic term that refers to a subjugated non-Muslim person living in a society dominated by Muslims. Second-class status is confirmed by the legal system and dhimmis do not share the rights of their Muslim rulers. (ex. of use: "Hey Jimmy, if you want to be a dhimmi, then you'd better learn how to shimmy.")
dhim·wit (dmwt ) - A non-Muslim member of a free society that abets the stated cause of Islamic domination with remarkable gullibility or guile. A dhimwit is always quick to extend sympathy to the very enemy that would take away his or her own freedom (or life) if given the opportunity.
I don't know how you have any patience for these idiots who post in all-caps because they think that shouting will get their point across. The fact is that Islam is a violent, hateful, intolerant, bigoted, misogynistic religion and there should be NO tolerance for it at all. I do not understand why there are so many converts to this horrific cult. I guess men are attracted to the notion of an eternal life consisting of non-stop sex with virgins, but what do women get out of it? What fate awaits them in heaven, IF they go to heaven at all? Do they get magically turned into virgins so they can spend infinity servicing the hard-ons of their male slave-masters? What kind of fate is that? What the hell IS the appeal of this pile of sewage called Islam?
I can only conclude that converts to that religion are just plain stupid. They don't deserve anything but scorn and derision. Anyone who would condone Islam on the grounds that not all of its adherents beat women and bomb churches is missing the point. "Islam is going through its Dark Ages," they say, as if that excuses anything, as if Muslims are merely misbehaving toddlers and we should all cut them some slack until they grow up. Those of you who say that need to pull your heads out of the sand and take a good, hard look at what the Quran condones. Join the 21st Century, for God's sake.
StripeyUnderpants said...
I don't know how you have any patience for these idiots who post in all-caps because they think that shouting will get their point across. The fact is that Islam is a violent, hateful, intolerant, bigoted, misogynistic religion and there should be NO tolerance for it at all. I do not understand why there are so many converts to this horrific cult. I guess men are attracted to the notion of an eternal life consisting of non-stop sex with virgins, but what do women get out of it? What fate awaits them in heaven, IF they go to heaven at all? Do they get magically turned into virgins so they can spend infinity servicing the hard-ons of their male slave-masters? What kind of fate is that? What the hell IS the appeal of this pile of sewage called Islam?
I can only conclude that converts to that religion are just plain stupid. They don't deserve anything but scorn and derision. Anyone who would condone Islam on the grounds that not all of its adherents beat women and bomb churches is missing the point. "Islam is going through its Dark Ages," they say, as if that excuses anything, as if Muslims are merely misbehaving toddlers and we should all cut them some slack until they grow up. Those of you who say that need to pull your heads out of the sand and take a good, hard look at what the Quran condones. Join the 21st Century, for God's sake.
I absolutely concur with your highly intelligent and knowledgeable assessment here. Islam is precisely as you have depicted it, and the converts must have severe mental problems, although many of them evidently don't display them outwardly. Some of them are simply incredibly ignorant about ANY religion, which is why we need MORE education about religion in the first place, to thwart this diseased ignorance from destroying us all.
As one indicator of the mental illness of converts, they are programmed to call themselves "reverts," because Islam mendaciously teaches them that they were born Muslim and that they are "reverting" to their "natural state" as Allah wants them to be. Not knowing anything about religion, philosophy, history or psychology, etc., these converts happily go along with this false concept, because it apparently makes them feel special and important. I would wager that in every instance a "revert" has emotional problems and some sort of trauma that drives them to need the antihuman structure, woman oppression and absolute conceit preached by Islam.
I couldn't put it any better than the last post. But.., you don't need the sewage of islam to create the hate that the philistinians have for israel. Israel does a fine job of that on it's own. And some of the palestinians who are victims of israel's MIC directed conquests are not muslim. Let's just hope that israel and the muslim world destroy each other.
I'd bet most palestinian suicide bombers are acting out of a completely understandable desire for revenge. Terrorists are generally mossad or cia assets posing as muslims to commit false flag ops thereby providing israel and the us with excuses to invade those countries who refuse to play ball with them. Oil rich iraq, opium rich afghanistan (the taliban had outlawed opium production thus robbing the cia of some of it's funding) had resources that the cia and oil companies wanted.
Islam's abuses consist of human right violations and it's mis-treatment of women and children.
Islam is a vile doctrine but a good percentage of arabs and persians would gladly accept secular government. They did in the past. Islam had little influence under saddam hussein, the soviet backed government of afghanistan or the mohammed mossadegh of iran.
Let's not confuse justifiable palestinian resentment with the vile religion that mohammed founded.
How any intelligent "thinking" individual could follow ANY religion is beyond me.In the event there is a GOD I doubt he has anything to do with religion, and that includes ISLAM,which I have no fear of criticizing. Your dear prophet Muhammad was nothing but a delusional pedophile much the same as today's Catholic Priests.
To those of you that would argue Acharya as "singled out" Islam or "crossed the line" you obviously have not read enough of her writings to know she has done neither.Some independent research may prove my point. Personally I don't know why she even bothers to respond to some of the posts.
I don't see why 'moderate muslims' feel the need to remain 'muslim' when they can easily lead a normal healthy life based upon common sense rather than having to rationalise what an ancient text says to fit into their 21st century existence.
The only reason 'moderate muslims' remain 'muslim' is because it's a religion they were born into and they enjoy feeling like they belong to a cultural group idenity. Intellectually speaking they surely can't defend the claim that the Koran (nor any so called "holy book") is somehow authored by a deity and clearly its sentiments are derived from his 8th century human authors... how can they continue to rationalise adhering to the guidelines written down by these ancient writers?? It's completely ridiculous.
Mahomet is no prophet. Can a prophet make a big error? He doesn't know that Adam is not the father of the humanity. Who was Adam? The lie of the book Genesis consisted of a manipulation of the text. Subchapters or subdivisions has been added, and so that corrupts our understanding. The original book has only phrases. So if you read simply the story, when Adam is created, the men were already on Earth and were not cultivating the soil. So the book of Genesis is dedicated to the elimination of the sons of Adam, the merovingians. So Mahomet is in the line of liars.
An exemple of lie is with the scrolls of the Dead Sea. It is very important for the theology of the unique son a certain phrase in Zechariah. But there is a missing phrase which stipulated two sons. Reading Zechariah, it would have been the conclusion there is to do, but believers have never been able to proceed to such a conclusion. If the missing phrase had been read, never the theology of the unique son would have been possible. So during Abraham epoch, they were preparing the other religion.
In Zechariah, there is a phrase which will stipulate the end of those religions. And that will be it, an end to the liars.
The priests, those behind those religions, have stolen the key. They are able of worldwide manipulation. As the fact that the Jesus and most of the apostles were red hair. Jesus was a pharaoth, a king of the kings. The Jews were egyptians of the south. The terrible desert, which the Mose refused to quit, was their homeland. Etcetera.
I believe in God. I do not believe in the bible or the coran.
Acharya,
i am a student at UoK, Pakistan. Over sometime i have found your books and lectures quite fascinating but regarding the subject of women's rights in muslim society i do have a few things to share out of my personal experience.
First and foremost thing is that women constitute 85% of the total 25000 students enrolled in the university of Karachi, Pakistan.
Second i want to share a few quotes out from quran since a whole big chapter # 4 in the book is named after "WOMEN". This is especially regarding inheritance of property by women since in pre-islamic arabia women had no rights of inheritence which was even true for most of european history. Just imagine how much refreshed a women would have felt 1400 some years ago of obtaining irrevocable rights of inheritence. Some quotes are follows...
There is a share for men and a share for women from what is left by parents and those nearest
related, whether, the property be small or large - a legal share. QURAN ( 4:7 )
And give to the women (whom you marry) their Mahr (obligatory bridal money given by the husband to his wife at the time of marriage) with a good heart, but if they, of their own good pleasure, remit any part of it to you, take it, and enjoy it without fear of any harm (as Allâh has made it lawful). QURAN ( 4:4 )
O you who believe! You are forbidden to inherit women against their will, and you should not treat
them with harshness, that you may take away part of the Mahr you have given them, unless they
commit open illegal sexual intercourse. And live with them honourably. If you dislike them, it may be that you dislike a thing and Allâh brings through it a great deal of good. QURAN ( 4:19 )
Now this was at the time when women were totally suppressed by the existing culture and usually were buried alive by the father at their birth. Not only that but the big boss in Islam, prophet mohammed also declared,
In the time of Prophet Muhammad, a man asked permission to go on a military expedition. The Prophet asked the man if he had a mother, when he replied yes, Prophet Muhammad said, “Stay with her because Paradise lies beneath her feet”. (Al-Tirmidhi)
Believe it or not but this is the most widely quoted narration of prophet mohammed in relation to the rights of mother. Also there is one more which says,
the Prophet said: "God has forbidden for you to be undutiful to your mothers." (Sahih Al-Bukhari)
the mother has been given greater priority as far as kindness is concerned. Once Hakim bin Hizam came to the Prophet of Islam and asked: "To whom should I be kind?" The Prophet replied, "Your mother." Hakim asked, "Then to whom?" The Prophet said, "Your mother." Hakim asked, "Then to whom?" The Prophet replied, "Your mother." Only when Hakim asked the fourth time that, "Then to whom?" the Prophet replied, "Your father." This shows that the right of mother upon the children is three times more than the rights of father as far as kindness is concerned.
The above mentioned narration is quoted very widely as well.Now all of this were spoken in a men dominated patriarchal society 1400 years ago as a result of which you will find women to be equally ardent campaigners in islamic preaching history as there were men.
The point i wanted to make is though the extremist interpretation of sharia which in islam is very flexible and supple to the needs of society has been the primary weapon of manipulation by the religious elite or contractors i might call, essentially because of the ignorance and lack of literacy among muslim masses. i must also add here that god in Quran only refers to scientific phenomenon in order to assert the evidence of its existence rather than any paranormal behavior. So there is no need to believe in any mysteries of islamic doctrine or creed prior to scientific and rational based confirmation. I hope you would comment on that...
Acharya,
i am a student at UoK, Pakistan. Over sometime i have found your books and lectures quite fascinating but regarding the subject of women's rights in muslim society i do have a few things to share out of my personal experience.
First and foremost thing is that women constitute 85% of the total 25000 students enrolled in the university of Karachi, Pakistan.
Second i want to share a few quotes out from quran since a whole big chapter # 4 in the book is named after "WOMEN". This is especially regarding inheritance of property by women since in pre-islamic arabia women had no rights of inheritance which was even true for most of european history. Just imagine how much refreshed a women would have felt 1400 some years ago of obtaining irrevocable rights of inheritance. Some quotes are follows...
There is a share for men and a share for women from what is left by parents and those nearest
related, whether, the property be small or large - a legal share. QURAN ( 4:7 )
And give to the women (whom you marry) their Mahr (obligatory bridal money given by the husband to his wife at the time of marriage) with a good heart, but if they, of their own good pleasure, remit any part of it to you, take it, and enjoy it without fear of any harm (as Allâh has made it lawful). QURAN ( 4:4 )
O you who believe! You are forbidden to inherit women against their will, and you should not treat
them with harshness, that you may take away part of the Mahr you have given them, unless they
commit open illegal sexual intercourse. And live with them honourably. If you dislike them, it may be that you dislike a thing and Allâh brings through it a great deal of good. QURAN ( 4:19 )
Now this was at the time when women were totally suppressed by the existing culture and usually were buried alive by the father at their birth. Not only that but the big boss in Islam, prophet mohammed also declared,
In the time of Prophet Muhammad, a man asked permission to go on a military expedition. The Prophet asked the man if he had a mother, when he replied yes, Prophet Muhammad said, “Stay with her because Paradise lies beneath her feet”. (Al-Tirmidhi)
Believe it or not but this is the most widely quoted narration of prophet mohammed in relation to the rights of mother. Also there is one more which says,
the Prophet said: "God has forbidden for you to be undutiful to your mothers." (Sahih Al-Bukhari)
the mother has been given greater priority as far as kindness is concerned. Once Hakim bin Hizam came to the Prophet of Islam and asked: "To whom should I be kind?" The Prophet replied, "Your mother." Hakim asked, "Then to whom?" The Prophet said, "Your mother." Hakim asked, "Then to whom?" The Prophet replied, "Your mother." Only when Hakim asked the fourth time that, "Then to whom?" the Prophet replied, "Your father." This shows that the right of mother upon the children is three times more than the rights of father as far as kindness is concerned.
The above mentioned narration is quoted very widely as well.Now all of this were spoken in a men dominated patriarchal society 1400 years ago as a result of which you will find women to be equally ardent campaigners in islamic preaching history as there were men.
The point i wanted to make is though the extremist interpretation of sharia which in islam is very flexible and supple to the needs of society has been the primary weapon of manipulation by the religious elite or contractors i might call, essentially because of the ignorance and lack of literacy among muslim masses. i must also add here that god in Quran only refers to scientific phenomenon in order to assert the evidence of its existence rather than any paranormal behavior. So there is no need to believe in any mysteries of islamic doctrine or creed prior to scientific and rational based confirmation. I hope you would comment on that...
Madam i must say that i am truly delighted to read your response. i confess this fact with no reservation at all that women are subjugated in a muslim society by men in a number of ways and the quranic theology only fosters this attitude. Actually i am a male student of chemistry at the karachi university and many a things you describe in your writings, i have literally witnessed them. Since you suggested me to free myself of islam, i would like to respond to that from my perspective.
while it is quite obvious that the religious teachings in islam exercises an extreme level of mind control from the very childhood and it continues always unabated in every aspect of life, i was born in a muslim family, have lived always in a muslim culture but i never attend any prayers or religious festivals including the friday prayers or others considered much more sacred and important. But the only thing that forces me to cling to islamic label is the scientific observations that are present in the quran. for instance i will state one example related to my subject chemistry that was only discovered by the scientific community in the 20th century which is about the nuclear stability of the metal IRON. The quran quotes,
Indeed We have sent Our Messengers with clear proofs, and revealed with them the Scripture and
the Balance that mankind may keep up justice. And We brought forth iron wherein is mighty
power, as well as many benefits for mankind, that Allâh may test who it is that
will help Him, and His Messengers in the unseen. Verily, Allâh is All-Strong, All-Mighty. QURAN ( 57:25)
If you see the chapter number and verse number here, as it is written in quran is actually incorrect because the first chapter is never considered a chapter but an introduction or summary in islamic traditions and the first verse is not incorporated in numbers because it appears with every chapter. Therefore, in effect the correct placement of this verse is ( 56:26 ) containing the word IRON which appears only once in quran.
Well guess what, 26 is the atomic number and 56 is the atomic mass of IRON. Furthermore,the reference to iron being very strong cannot imply to physical stability because iron in pure form is malleable and corrodes into rust easily, it can only imply to nuclear stability of IRON since it is greater than any other elements nuclei and its average binding energy per nucleon is maximum (only discovered in 20th century).
Now in arabian desert nobody knew anything about atoms, let alone the nuclear stability. There are also some examples i like from Dr. Maurice Bucaille book "The bible, the quran and science".
If one has scientific perspective in judgement on older books, than i guess quran does have some charm in it. Would love to see your response on it.
I see you are using the typical apologist tactics here. I'm afraid they won't work, as I am not vulnerable to mindless proselytizing of nonsensical and barbaric Stone Age cults.
The Koran is NOT an accurate science book by any stretch of the imagination. There are many sites that debunk such absurd claims. This apologist tactic is so well known Wikipedia even has an entry on it:
Qur'an and science
"The belief that Qur'an had prophesied scientific theories and discoveries - known as Ijaz al-Qur'an - has become a strong and widespread belief in the contemporary Islamic world. Alleged prophecies are often provided to show a connection between the Qur'an and miracles, and to support the belief of divine origin for the Qur'an....
"The most famous proponent of this argument is perhaps Maurice Bucaille, a French physician and author of the popular book The Bible, The Qur'an and Science.... Bucaille's opinion did not gain scientific consensus on the matter; critics claim that 'Bucaille bends the meaning of the Arabic words to suit his own ideas' and 'Bucaille proposes new meanings for Qur'anic words to bring them into accord with modern scientific knowledge, without requiring any standard philological justification.' The translator of The Bible, The Qur'an and Science into Indonesian, Dr. Muhammad Rasjidi, former Professor for Islamic Studies at McGill University and former Indonesian Minister for Religious Affairs characterizes [Bucaille's thesis] as 'a half-baked mish-mash of pseudo-science and pseudo-exegesis'."
Once again, I encourage you to free yourself from this alien slave cult that invaded your land and subjugated your ancestors (and you).
Cheers.
i am never a preacher of islam nor do i gain anything thereby proselytizing for its cult. i will even state that the muslim preachers who have tried to convince me of adopting their mind set have utterly failed since i never practice any of the religious rites at all. The label or designation being whosoever, really does not mean anything when one has a perspective and a lifestyle of his own, since this kind of a person can be more harmful for the existing mind control of the community and push it to become defensive, the very same thing that you have inflicted upon christianity.
i am thankful to you for sharing information about Maurice Bucaille's work that it is not authentic to be considered. As far as that iron stuff is concerned, this is not from maurice bucaille book. The mention of atomic number there is present in one of harun yahya book but the understanding of atomic mass and stability of iron nucleus is the observation of my own, being a chemistry student, and believe me there is no language manipulation here since i also depend on translation for understanding quran. i was just naturally surprised to see the two numbers 56 and 26 together with each other, the statistical probability of whose occurrence is infinitesimally low, and the mention of it having great strength inside of it was scientifically appealing.
May be it is just because i study chemistry that it was appealing to me, who knows.. Therefore, i personally think that the profound consciousness that exhibits itself in the intelligent works of nature embodies scientific principles and being fortunate enough to glimpse at its majesty, the human race should be practically grateful by exploring it further. To do this is to me, my religion. Therefore, anything unscientific or irrational is just a hoax.
Many cheers...
i was just naturally surprised to see the two numbers 56 and 26 together with each other..
You didn't understand a word Acharya had written.
This inability to hear, to believe the simple cut-out life of Islam, may actually be genetic, because my Indian Hindu friends are just the same, ascribing good or bad luck and coincidence as ordained fortune, and it might be a genetic depletion of the brain caused by thousands of years of inbreeding, with Hinduism as the dominant ideology, that has made their minds only perceive Jinns everywhere and to appease The Biggest Jinn of a All.
Maybe mankind is not a level playing field at all.
The biggest threat to humanity then may be the reproduction of brains incapable of any insight and intuition. Those who would kill the Unbelieving child for fear of retribution from the rest of society.
“This inability to hear, to believe the simple cut-out life of Islam, may actually be genetic”,
I consider it oversimplification to attribute genetic influences to be prime in the formation of social structure as it underestimates the power of mankind’s conscious evolution through positive thinking. Also no one can put barriers on thoughts just by intimidation of non survival, the justification of which is the ‘intellect’ lying at the disposal of anyone who wishes to explore it...
But the choice of not using the reasonable thought process is rather embedded in the environment created by ignorant politicians, priests, celebrities and so on, who attempt to regulate the culture by inducing emotional manipulation of masses. The only geniune solution for such a target can be non-cooperation to the official or social norms to the greatest stretch as possible by the individual...
Immediately after 9/11 I was online, talking to a Moslem man in India. I asked him, "what is your opinion of the attacks on the WTC?"
"Perhaps they were necessary; perhaps Allah told them to crash the buildings." I went further and asked what he thought of Mohammed having a 9 year old wife.
"That was all right in those days, things were different." Among all the Moslems I have talked to since, NOT ONE has ever condemned the events of 9'11. Everyone may make up their own mind. I made up mine.
I am curious ,I see under the comment box,"This blog does not allow anonymous comments", yet I have come across a number of anonymous posts. What is the truth?
Regards .Bridget
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